Programming live shows using MIDI controller (AKAI APC mini)

[TPotgens]

Hi all,

Quick question (or not..). I have been searching on the forum for quite some time, but I can't find the desired answer/solution.

I bought an AKAI APC mini controller to make live shows easier. I had the idea to use the different colors on the launchpad for different situations (i.e. RED -> preset colors; GREEN -> preset movements; YELLOW -> strobe, dimming FX, blinding, etc.).

I don't like to use submasters for performing the shows. In the past I only used it to make easy cue lists (and then buttons). Using the midi controller I only want to start a single sequence of each fixture group (for example color Red) using a specific pad. Then I can combine pads to make a 'live' show.

I started making cue lists containing only 1 sequence, but then I am limited to the 16 cue list buttons I can address to the midi controller. When mapping different cue list tabs I thought I would extend the number of buttons I can address. Unfortunately, this is not possible as it is only possible to address one button and not multiple buttons to for example cue list 1.

Can someone help me how to programm this? Or is this not possible? I tried to also use override buttons for this, but this is not working like I want it to do. Also override buttons are not meant for this, I know..

In the attachment I added a picture of the design of the AKAI APC mini I try to achieve. As mentioned earlier RED is color presets (sequences or cues), GREEN is movements and YELLOW other.

Second question:
I would like to map for example the gobo rotation channel to an fader. This was easy to do, but I do need to select the fixture first. When mapping for example group 2 button it will not select the fixtures of group 2 (MH's). How can I solve this? Mapping next fixture is working, but I need the whole group to be selected in order to make changes in gobo rotation using the fader to all MH's and not only the one selected.

Thanks in advance. Keep up the good work.

Best regards,
Thom

[jacopo]

Hello! I have the akai apc mini mk2, and I think I've programmed it similar to your idea. I'm not using cue list buttons but just one cue list, I programmed all the 20 sequences (some for colors, some for changing time colors, some for movements of moving heads) and I'm using ALL the override buttons for static gobos, static colors for just heads, some other strobo and some flash buttons... don't use buttons for movements of moving heads, it will not work.... anyway like this I can combine 54 sequences, it isn't so bad

[jacopo]

Also I'm using fader for master intensity, dimmer, red, blue, white, etc.... BUT if you have suggestion to control group intensity with faders, tell me... I'm finding a way XD

[TPotgens]

Hello! I have the akai apc mini mk2, and I think I've programmed it similar to your idea. I'm not using cue list buttons but just one cue list, I programmed all the 20 sequences (some for colors, some for changing time colors, some for movements of moving heads) and I'm using ALL the override buttons for static gobos, static colors for just heads, some other strobo and some flash buttons... don't use buttons for movements of moving heads, it will not work.... anyway like this I can combine 54 sequences, it isn't so bad

Thanks for the input Jacopo! That is a nice workaround. Unfortunately, I have some extra demands.. I would like to use the faders for scene times (movements, colors), but then I need to have all movements as for example sequence 2. In order to do that I have to make multiple cue lists. Using multiple cue lists it is not possible to use one fader for all color sequences.

I have been looking into switching to Daslight 4 the last few days. The use of scenes and mapping of multiple midi actions on the same buttons is exactly what I need/want to do. This functionality is present in Daslight. I have been working with a Chimp300 for quite some time and missing some functionalities in freestyler. I understand this is freeware and completely different than professional controllers.

[DimiBo]

Hello,

I also have 2 Akai Mini MK2's.
I have midi mapped on top my groups( example group 1 are 2 moving heads, group 2 also other moving heads).

I now want to select for example group 1 and choose the colour from the right buttons.
And then select another group with another colour.
Also when i select 2 groups, i can choose the same colour for those 2 groups ...

Is this possible in freestyler ?
How can i Fix this please?

I also want to do something like this for the movements ... (circle, rectangle, center, ...)

Hope somebody can help with this ...

Kind regards!!!

[Partyman]

Ok, To start there are 32 cue list buttons available and 32 Override button available per page. Use Cuelists to control movement, dimmer (on Movers), color, gobo, and prism. Then make override buttons for color, gobo, strobe, and prism. You will then have cues that are fully functional and the complete ability to tansform with override buttons or Faders.
Use Red buttons over Faders to select groups and use faders for gobo, color, prism, ... I use the far right Fader as master intensity and fader next to it as master speed. Square button for blackout and green buttons on right side for Tap, Tap release, Release all, and release override buttons. I set Cuelist buttons to Green and green flashing for active. I set Overrides to Yellow and Yellow flashing when active

[DimiBo]

Hello,
Thanks for the reply !

But at this moment I doen't understand the cue list buttons ...
The override buttons are scenes and overrules everything. So that i understand. Ok.
But those other buttons (cue list buttons) ... ??? Must I put them (the cue list) in a submaster or not ?
Do you have an example or example screen or ...

Kind regards !

[Partyman]

Create a folder for every fixture group
Create scenes that ONLY control 1 group
Create scenes for each of the groups
Create a blackout scene for every group
Load 1 scene from every group into the sequence window(blackout scenes for fixture you dont want in scene)
Adjust speeds and parameters of each scene
Save as a Cue
Insert Cue in cuelist
* Make sure "multiselect" is checked in cue settings
Now when you hit any cuelist button it will fire a scene for every fixture group and be a complete look
Here is what my cuelist window might look like with 5 groups

Freestyler Cue.jpg

* pushing the squares with arrow button at top right of cue window will give you 32 cuelist buttons

[DimiBo]

Hello,
Ok, I think i understand it now. I will give it a try
Am I correct to say that a scene can be a colour or a gobo or a movement for example ?

Other question then... If i create different scenes per group (for example different colours per group), then i can put those scenes in a cuelist, and safe that list for integration in the submasters ... Il allready did that before...

What is now better to work with ? The cuelist buttons or the submasters ?

Cuelist buttons can be used for triggering multiple groups and Submasters for changing per group ?

Thanks !

[Partyman]

The choice depends on which workflow serves you best. I prefer using cuelists in most situations over submasters. When using Submasters each cuelist will be all colors or movements or gobos...
When using strictly cuelists (no submasters) I put a scene for each fixture group into every cue so that when i change cuelist buttons it is a completely new look, all lights transform with one button. I then use the override buttons make changes over the top of running cuelist (colors, prizm, strobe,...) Using submasters you can give yourself more options but it requires multiple button presses to accomplish things.
With the push of one button I can make my:
Led Pars do a chase to the beat of the music using whatever colors I selected
Make 1 set of movers to slow circles with prizm (whatever color)
Make another set of movers doing ballyhoo
Another set of pars doing slow white strobe
Wizard doing ...
Lasers doing whatever

All done with one button. The same look would require 6 button presses using submasters

One Hint! When programming individual scenes to be loaded into cuelists make sure ALL channels are active in the scene whether used or not, meaning every channel of every fixture used in a scene should either be yellow or green (no red channels or you will get residual things happening)

[DimiBo]

Thanks a lot for the good reply. I makes more clear for me.
I think that i will use your methode with the cue list buttons.
Before i used the submasters, but like u said, i must push more buttons to change from scenes...

Another question. Where do you put for example a laser, or a simple light effect ? Also in buttons, or do you pilot it standalone?

[Partyman]

still use cuelist and have other fixtures blackout during laser use for maximum effectI also keep sound active laser on an override button.

[DimiBo]

Hello,

Some weeks further now ...
I created my override buttons for the colours on all fixtures (red, green, bleu, white, ...) and thats working fine. When i tab a ovveride, everything changes the way i want it.

Also i created some override buttone to launch the "simple light effects in sound mode" and thats also working.

Then i created some scenes ant put that in a cue list, saved thay and put this in the cue list buttons. When i launch my different program(cue's) the show from that button starts like i want, so thats ok.

BUT ... when there is a show/cue running, and I tab a override button (for example the colour red, everything is going to red, so thats ok. But when i release the override button the colour red is gone and the show moves furthes, BUT all the movement of my moving heads stops ... they go to a certain 'stop' position ...

Somebody that can help me further for this please ?

Thanks !!!

[Partyman]

When programing OR buttons for color or gobo make sure all other channels have the red x

[DimiBo]

Hello,
The OR buttons are programmed with the pan/tilt moments in red ...
When i push the OR button, the moment is going well.

But when i stop de OR button, then the pan, tilt go to e fix center position ...

[Partyman]

May be a bug, do you have option: Cue "go to previous value" always enabled selected? it is in freestyler setup extra options

[DimiBo]

Hi, thanks. It was not enabled...
Now i have enabled it and now it is working !!!
Is that possible ? What does this function do ?

Are there other options that i should check ?

[Partyman]

it makes it return to whatever it was doing before you hit the OR button

[DimiBo]

Top! Thanks for the help and replies !!!
Now i use the or buttons and the cue buttons. More easy to work with for my use, its more simple than the submasters.

Other question. Is there an option that you can say this OR button clearing the other buttons, but not all the buttons on that page. For examplr the colour button may clear each other, but not the 5 buttons from the effect... os that possible ?

[Partyman]

there are midi options for "release all" which stops all running sequences or "disable all buttons"
Just scroll through all the options so you know what is available