Sound to light problem

[LINEMAN]

I have the latest ver of FS and I currently have my lights working just fine.I am using VirtualDj and the Numark DJIO sound card.
The lights dont go with the BPM at all.I have assigned all fixtures to work with sound and activated them in the cue screen also.I have read on a few forums about Midiyoke app and Audiobox PATCH?????? I found the Midiyoke website but the other link I founs no longer has this available.
Can someone help me with this if they can? This is a must have for playing gigs which Im sure most of you can relate with

Mabe an alternative? I am using XP PRO,Entec open,VDJ.NUMARK DJIO SOUND CARD,EXTERNAL MIXER. ASIO DRIVERS.
i CAN SEE the Numark sound card listed in LIGHT/SOUND window.
Does DMX400 mean anything?? and what DMX400?

[MTurner]

Hi There...

I am Wrestling with the same problem at the moment.
I have 2 pcs. 1 with Virtual DJ, and the second with Freestyler.
4 scans, 2 ADJ Revo 3's and a laser.

I have a Velleman DMX Interface which seems to be to slow the job.
Does anyone know if DMX changes should be 100% instant when output to the lights ?.
I have read all the posts about the velleman interface being a bit crappy....

The sound to light in freestyler is about as good as its going to get. Midi triggers would seem to offer a better solution to sync.
What i can't believe is that there not a simple way of syncing freestyler to common dj programs via midi.
Obviously this relies on programs and companies talking to each other.
Virtual DJ has beat match sussed, but does not output any sort of trigger over midi.

Have tried decadance which does output a midi clock, but the program sucks in other areas. e.g. finding songs is poor and syncing basically does not work. (I have over 15,000).

Really frustrated that their does not seem to be a sensible way of achiving the same thing with manual programming, as when you just turn lights on to sound to active mode. If you have a load of lights though this just becomes a mess !

I have been on at virtual dj to output a midi trigger, but they seem to bust thinking about something else...
What could be more important for PC DJ's ?....
Not sure...

Anyway have fun.
Martin

[remco_k]

I have the latest ver of FS and I currently have my lights working just fine.I am using VirtualDj and the Numark DJIO sound card.
The lights dont go with the BPM at all.I have assigned all fixtures to work with sound and activated them in the cue screen also.I have read on a few forums about Midiyoke app and Audiobox PATCH?????? I found the Midiyoke website but the other link I founs no longer has this available.
Can someone help me with this if they can? This is a must have for playing gigs which Im sure most of you can relate with

Mabe an alternative? I am using XP PRO,Entec open,VDJ.NUMARK DJIO SOUND CARD,EXTERNAL MIXER. ASIO DRIVERS.
i CAN SEE the Numark sound card listed in LIGHT/SOUND window.
Does DMX400 mean anything?? and what DMX400?

Your posting is a bit hard to understand somehow. Have you actually started the Sound 2 Light application in FreeStyler? (Press the speaker icon).
If so, configure that application so it looks like it triggers good on the beat. Does that work okay? (If not: make it work okay!)
How is the audio connected to your soundcard? By a line or (built in) mic?

Hi There...
I am Wrestling with the same problem at the moment.

I have 2 pcs. 1 with Virtual DJ, and the second with Freestyler.
4 scans, 2 ADJ Revo 3's and a laser.

I have a Velleman DMX Interface which seems to be to slow the job.
Does anyone know if DMX changes should be 100% instant when output to the lights ?.
I have read all the posts about the velleman interface being a bit crappy....

This is far from the same problem that LINEMAN has.
Lets start by saying I have digged into the Velleman VM116/K8062 really deep. It is a crapy interface and it gets way tooooo sloooooooo when using more and more DMX channels at the same time.

To answer your question of DMX changes should be 100% instant: Yes (kind of). Within 74 msec for sure. (when not using the Velleman interface, but a good one).
One DMX "packet" (containing ALL the channel values) takes about 24 msec to sent. Therefore the time from change in FreeStyler to light change should not be longer than 48 msec (24 x 2). But FreeStyler has a Refresh rate setting default at 50 msec. So in theory, with the refresh rate set to 50 msec, it could take max 50+24 msec for your lights to respond (74 msec).
You can change the refresh rate to 20 msec by pressing the advanced button in the setup, this function is only available with some types of DMX interfaces.
This wil speed up the reponse time of your lights to 44 msec. This wont work with the Velleman interface because this thing is too slow.
It will only work this fast with the Velleman interface when using a maximum number of channels below 50 or so.
If you want to solve this, buy a better interface like the Enttec USB to DMX Pro.

The sound to light in freestyler is about as good as its going to get. Midi triggers would seem to offer a better solution to sync.
What i can't believe is that there not a simple way of syncing freestyler to common dj programs via midi.
Obviously this relies on programs and companies talking to each other.
Virtual DJ has beat match sussed, but does not output any sort of trigger over midi.

Most people seem to forget that playout software like that also haven't got a really good beat trigger also. They might have a pretty good BPM counter, but thats quite something else... Thats why the Sound 2 Light application exists.

Really frustrated that their does not seem to be a sensible way of achiving the same thing with manual programming, as when you just turn lights on to sound to active mode. If you have a load of lights though this just becomes a mess !

Buy yourself a new DMX interface that is actually made for keeping up the real speeds and most of your problems are solved.
Otherwise, don't blame any other software for it. It is the Velleman interface that is to blame.

For LINEMAN, there is a whole other problem.

[LINEMAN]

Thanks for responding REMCO_K
I have the ENTEC DMX OPEN connected directly to usb port on my laptop.I can get the music to respond by using the default sound card but my music from VDJ uses the ASIO numark djio external sound card.This card is also a usb plugin with rca going directly to my mixer.
When I go to chose the Numark card in the sound2 light window it come back with a "Check cababilities error " (Im at work now and cant remember all the words following...).I went into my Control Panel and tried changing the mic/in to numark {was previously set to Sound max) and that didnt work.Mabe a reboot needed after the change?

[remco_k]

Thanks for responding REMCO_K
I have the ENTEC DMX OPEN connected directly to usb port on my laptop.I can get the music to respond by using the default sound card but my music from VDJ uses the ASIO numark djio external sound card.This card is also a usb plugin with rca going directly to my mixer.
When I go to chose the Numark card in the sound2 light window it come back with a "Check cababilities error " (Im at work now and cant remember all the words following...).I went into my Control Panel and tried changing the mic/in to numark {was previously set to Sound max) and that didnt work.Mabe a reboot needed after the change?

The Numark DJIO is an audio output only device is'nt it?
So audio recording (is what the S2L application does), is not possible with that device.
Meaning that you can't use the Numark DJIO in the S2L application.

You need to use an extra audio output from your mixer (2nd master or tape output), connect that to the line-in of your default soundcard, select the line-in as recording device and then configure S2L to use your default soundcard. Or use an built in mic in your laptop, but this will not work as good as a direct cable connection from your mixer.

[LINEMAN]

thankyou..will give it a go tonight and see what happens .
Output from mixer..to mic input on laptop.

[remco_k]

thankyou..will give it a go tonight and see what happens .
Output from mixer..to mic input on laptop.

That wont work. A mic input is not the same as a line input.
You should do this: Output from mixer to line input on laptop.

Now that you mention it: not all laptops have line inputs. So there might be a problem with that.
You can make (or buy) a 20 to 50 dB pad. That way you might be able to connect a line signal source to an mic input.

[LINEMAN]

Got it to work..I did gave an audio input..thanks to Alienware..now I am trying to understand the sliders and how they work.I find that the lights start to go out of sink...and the BPM are not perfectly matched in S2L but almost.Any tips on tweaking?

[remco_k]

Got it to work..I did gave an audio input..thanks to Alienware..now I am trying to understand the sliders and how they work.I find that the lights start to go out of sink...and the BPM are not perfectly matched in S2L but almost.Any tips on tweaking?

Thats good.
Is the AGC enabled? try and set the Frequency slider somewhere about 150 to 250 Hz, and see what goes. Next, slide the treshold to a point where the beat detector is detecting beats at the proper points. Then use the beat decay slider. That slider controls the amount of time that no beat is generated.
Beat detection is kind of hard to do, so don't expect 100% perfection from a beat detector.
And don't be mislead by the BPM counter as that is just an indicator it does'nt say anything about how good it is working. What is important is the Beat button. You should make settings so that the Beat button lights up once at every beat.

But before going that far: try the beta version of the Sound 2 Light app, can be found on my website. There is more automatic functionality in it, like ATC (Auto Treshold control) and ABC (Auto Beat decay Control).
See my website for more information: http://www.digiplay.nl/fs/

This beta should work better for more types of music (almost) without having to adapt settings every new song. But still, beat detection is not as easy as it seems.

[LINEMAN]

Will try the Beta but whilr playing around I started to figure out how it works..and its working pretty well so far.
If I may ask about a different issue with my lights after I have played a song and I would like to have the lights quit at the end of its sequence,I unchecked loop and the red arrow indicates it will stop but as of this moment I have a set of chasing pars that just wont quit no matter what until I hit the blackout and then it goes out..for the moment till I uncheck it and its back on.
Is there a way to "refresh" per say that would black out all lights once the sequence ends or inactive? or better yet unclicked?
you know what I mean?
I did set one of my sequences with chasing pars and the last step I set to black and that does work..when you unloop the sequence.
Im looking for a blackout or refresh or reset so all sequences stay off ,even though the blackout button is not touched.

Im trying to wrap my brain about the "favorite" button and what is its purpose

[remco_k]

But what should trigger the blackout then if it is'nt you touching a button?

(going to bed now, it is 1:27 AM here. Damn, still need to walk the dog)

[MTurner]

Hey Lineman

Otherwise, don't blame any other software for it. It is the Velleman interface that is to blame.

I am sorry if it sounded like i was blaming the software, which is excellent. Thanks for developing it.
Entec pro USB on its way.

Would it be possible to develop a way of triggering a configurable number of steps for each beat?.

What i would like to do is to get each beat to trigger say 4 steps of a sequence. That way i could get all my lights to strobe one after the other very quickly starting on each beat detected by the sound to light.

This would really need to be configurable per Cue, rather than an overall setting i think.

Thanks again

Best Regards
Martin

[LINEMAN]

Remco_k
I just picked up a small Dell laptop 1.8gz 1 gig ram and am running FS on it.My original laptop I had running VDJ locked up on me during an event,,so I decided to run FS on its own laptop.This laptop has only a mic/headset connections..no audio input.
I have a 1/4 plug coming out of my headset plug on my mixer and going to a 1/8 input on the mic on the laptop.S2L sees it and does respond with the music but volume control is VERY SENSITIVE.The 20 -50 db pad you suggested earlier...would that help keeping the signal a bit more under control? Can I get one that will adapt with an 1/8 in/out? Would adjusting the mic input volume do the same thing?

[remco_k]

Remco_k
I have a 1/4 plug coming out of my headset plug on my mixer and going to a 1/8 input on the mic on the laptop.S2L sees it and does respond with the music but volume control is VERY SENSITIVE. The 20 -50 db pad you suggested earlier...would that help keeping the signal a bit more under control?

Yes, it will.

Can I get one that will adapt with an 1/8 in/out?

Never seen it ready made. But creating one yourself should be too hard. (few resistors, soldering iron and some connectors)

Would adjusting the mic input volume do the same thing?

No. The (mic/line) input volume adjust of almost all (cheap) soundcards is done after A/D conversion. Its the A/D converter (or the pre-amp before that) that is "overloaded" and is clipping big time. So it would not make any difference, except that the disturbed signal is coming in softer. The quality remains bad.

Inserting a pad of -X dB before the mic input is the only way to get the signal better in level.
Ofcourse, might be needless to say, using a line input is preferred. But if you haven't got one....

Also a little warning: most soundcard mic inputs provide 5V DC phantom power. In the past I've destroyed a PA Live mixer output with that when connecting the master output by accident to the mic input of a soundcard. Be carefull. With the -X dB pad in between and maybe a capacitor to defeat the phantom power, you should be safe.

[lineman55]

Thankyou remco_k I will have to make this work with the info you gave me.
In the meantime..may you and your family have a wonderful Holiday!

[LINEMAN]

Just an update...I had a friend of mine resolve the resister/attenuator matter because he repairs radios where I work and I must say..What a difference!!! Much more responsive with the beats and music.Thankyou again

[gnuyts]

Meld dit berichtAntwoord met een citaatRe: Sound to light problem
door remco_k » vr nov 13, 2009 4:37 pm

LINEMAN schreef:
Thanks for responding REMCO_K
I have the ENTEC DMX OPEN connected directly to usb port on my laptop.I can get the music to respond by using the default sound card but my music from VDJ uses the ASIO numark djio external sound card.This card is also a usb plugin with rca going directly to my mixer.
When I go to chose the Numark card in the sound2 light window it come back with a "Check cababilities error " (Im at work now and cant remember all the words following...).I went into my Control Panel and tried changing the mic/in to numark {was previously set to Sound max) and that didnt work.Mabe a reboot needed after the change?
The Numark DJIO is an audio output only device is'nt it?
So audio recording (is what the S2L application does), is not possible with that device.
Meaning that you can't use the Numark DJIO in the S2L application.

You need to use an extra audio output from your mixer (2nd master or tape output), connect that to the line-in of your default soundcard, select the line-in as recording device and then configure S2L to use your default soundcard. Or use an built in mic in your laptop, but this will not work as good as a direct cable connection from your mixer.

I'm new on this and I use freestyler for fun and I have a small question. When you run freestyler and a music player on the same PC, can you than connect the line-out from the internal soundcard directly to the line-in of the same soundcard if I want to use S2L?
Regards, Gert

[remco_k]

I'm new on this and I use freestyler for fun and I have a small question. When you run freestyler and a music player on the same PC, can you than connect the line-out from the internal soundcard directly to the line-in of the same soundcard if I want to use S2L?
Regards, Gert

- Select the same soundcard in S2L you are playing the audio on.
- Go to the place in windows where you can select the record source on the soundcard, most of the time you can select things like line-in and mic, but also "what you hear" or "stereo mix" or something similar in your language. Where and how to select depends on your windows version and driver of your soundcard. You might want to google around for a guide on how to record playing audio. (And look at S2L as a recording application).

[gnuyts]

Hi Remco_k

Thanks, It's working great.

Gert